N E V E 5 0 1 2

A short citation from the web site:

"The signal path is simple and very short. On the input is a Transformer-Like-Amplifier (TLA) which uses extremely low noise, discrete components to avoid the winding resistances, inductance restrictions, and non-linear magnetization curves of even the highest-grade iron core materials found in transformers. This functions as a sort of prepping for the actual input transformer that follows in the signal path so that the transformer sees a constant level and impedance, maximizing the sonic benefits while minimizing the weaknesses of a transformer-based front-end."

So the pre is like the green amp followed by the input transformer then some other circuitry followed by the output transformer. I've tried (twice actually, in green pre thread) to suggest people trying to replace the diff amp in green pre with a transformer but so far nobody to seems to think like Robert. What kind of transformer would be best in green circuit? I'd like to actually try something like that eventually..

I don´t know... I´ll call it a simple interstage transformer, or am I getting something wrong here?

The idea is there for quite some time in tube technology. Actually in early tube units, like 1930-1940, it´s even more common. So, what´s new about it?

In fact, in a SS micamp with very low noise input, I think it´s kind of clumsy. the good thing about a transformer coupled mic pre is how it reacts very differently to each mic, IMHO. That´s what´s good about it. I mean maybe you have mic A (let´s say a ribbon mic) that sounds wonderfull with that UTC input and sounds like trash with that cheap OEP, but mic B (let´s say a hot condenser mic) might sound wonderfull with the cheap OEP, and not so interesting with the big UTC.

So, if you do not have this"feature" in a transformer based mic preamp, I think it miss the most important aspec of the thig.

That said, a nice interstage preamp might sound really good after a clean SS preamp front-end, and might actually make it very interesting, but I can´t really say, as I never tried anything like this.

Certainly helps separate the product from all the others out there. Good from a marketing perspective.............. however, from the Neve website:

Portico modules embody new Rupert-designed transformers, very short audio paths, minimal negative feedback and discrete single-sided transformer-coupled outputs that leave no possibility of crossover distortion.

Click to expand...

What kind of transformer would be best in green circuit?

Click to expand...

Have a look at the Cinemag CMOL-2x600T2.

Samuel

Hmm, at first Txs are kind of put aside, but then suddenly after some prepping a TX is needed... :?

What's the virtue of interstage-TXs when they're made as transparant as possible ?

Regards,

Peter

What's the virtue of interstage-TXs when they're made as transparant as possible ?

Click to expand...

isn´t it clear? Marketing, off coarse.

[quote author="rafafredd"]

What's the virtue of interstage-TXs when they're made as transparant as possible ?

Click to expand...

isn´t it clear? Marketing, off coarse.[/quote]

Hmmm.
Looks like companies can get away with any 'silly' tech-stuff as long
as a nice story on glossy paper can be brought forward....

Not saying already it's also the case here - since Nv is of a different league than various others.
So for now let me say I'm not getting it yet what they're after with an approach like that.

No, I think there is more to it than just marketing. Interstage transformers can be slightly better than R/C. Which is why really high end hifi gear uses them. I'd have to dig out my Radiotron Handbook...I'll do it later... but....I think the quote is "in most cases properly designed R/C coupling is good enough at a far reduced cost".

I would consider a couple of factors. Firstly the Name .......Neve.... premium. Premium brand name needs a premium product. Put the two together and you can charge a premium price.

Next.... what is the name synomous with? Analog sound. He states on his website that his products are built to capture that, and improve on previous designs. He even has a tape emulator. ........He uses single sided circuits. I'm not a tech. Why would he do that?

So ..... I would surmise that he has used interstage transformers (specially designed by him) to ENHANCE the analog type sound. I suspect that his comment about crossover distortion is a bit of a red herring. While it would be true, it doesn't define their true purpose. Over at Tape Op there are some posts that suggest a "transformer box" ie running your mix through a couple of transformers to skew off the signal and make it sound better. More air.....whatever.....

So, that would give a hole in one. Single sided classic Neve circuits, improved with better components, front end to boost the signal before running through a transformer or two designed to give a really nice smooth full sound...... Neve brand name ...... priced accordingly so they can stay in business ...... hell, I want one.
:green:

[Also, it'll be damn hard for anyone to reverse engineer one of their products and get the same sound. Transformers cost serious money...... whether you set up to wind them or subcontract them. There is a bit of protection from both the Chinese, and other copycats.]

(I might be wrong, but a couple of those noses in the website photo look similar. )

Also, an input transformer works different sepending on the source. Using an interstage transformer would give you total control over the quality of the "transformer sound" you are implying to a track. I mean, the "tranmsformer sound" is always the same, as there´s no impedance interaction with the source.

Personally I think the CIB sounded better with a transformerless I/P and a transformer O/P.

Sorr