SSL 9K Mic Pre Thread 2009

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understood - I'm just saying that I've seen a LOT of IC copies recently.
In some cases, they'll take a regular opamp, and etch a better opamps name on top.
It works in a functional test, but performance can be challenged.
That may not be a concern with the MAT02, but it's worth considering.

Any devices which are "work or fail" should be okay (e.g. resistors, led's etc)... as the seller doesn't want any issues.
Devices like regulators, opamps etc that share pinouts with lower performance devices, should always be bought from a trusted source. (ideally distributors), because you could buy 100 of them, and suddenly find that what you thought were high end opamps were in fact $0.10 opamps rebranded.

cheers

/R
 
yes , that's right , but i don't know how to know what it's true or fake like i'm beginer i think i don't have the material to test ,and more, i don't know how to test.

until now all the  compenents work, and before buying i do so much search and i ask so much question but we never know hope will continue
 
I think ebay stores with high star rating are serious , as StK , I've never had problems with chinese components...
 
I asked futurlec for LM394 wich is out of stock and...

"Dear Sir,

Thanks for your enquiry, sorry however this part has been discontinued by the manufacturer and we are not sure if new stocks will be available again."
:-\


 
Ok, So I just received the MAT02s that stereokillah directed me to.  I'm attaching a picture for you to look at them and make a judgment yourself.  I know of course, that as rochey said, they could have just printed the markings on there to look like the real thing, but, you decide!  I haven't plugged them in or tested them in any way.  If someone knows of a good and relatively easy way to test these to determine whether they are acceptable or not from a more analytical standpoint (as opposed to just popping them in and listening) I'd be glad to do it.  I have a 2MHz function generator and a Oscope and a DMM, so I'd have to be able to do it with those tools.

Now don't go trying to steel my identity with those fingerprints!   :p :p

As for the contact that stereokillah gave and the company they came from, very clear and open communication.  very nice and accessible person that I dealt with.  She was there until the end.  They ship UPS and I wasn't in town to sign for it, so it was being held at the UPS hub.  she contacted me and said that her ups rep told her about it being held and wanted to alert me of that, and to make sure that I was going to be able to pick them up.  Very considerate.  Shipping was less that 2 weeks from 1st contact.

As long as they are genuine, good quality MAT02's, I highly recommend purchasing from them.  The only complaint I have so far is that they smell like moth balls!  I guess that's the price you pay.
 

Attachments

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    mat02.JPG
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for what it's worth I got MAT02s from Analog once and they were etched/engraved/whatever on top, not printed. Not saying these are fake, but even if they are, as long as they're low noise type transitors, general consensus is they'll work. If your DMM has and hFE tester, I'd be curious to see what it says. Mine were up near or past 700.
 
I've received some mat02AH from the same source. They were very porfessional and nice to deal with. Total of the transaction is 100 euros to my door (don't forget taxes + ups cut on taxes) for 10 units, wich seem very real to me... (yes I'm selling some of them on the BM too).

There are pictures of printed MAT02 on google if you do a search there. Another pic here .
 
I just found the corrected 9K schemo again today, so here it is,  Please put this in the first post so everyone has it. Neeno's pdf has the original schemo which has mistakes. It might actually be good to download this file and attach it to your post so that is stays there and doesn't disappear if this guy's comcast account disappears. Or someone with PDF editiing capabilities could replace the schemo in Neeno's PDF with this.

link removed..error in schematic, see below
 
mitsos said:
I just found the corrected 9K schemo again today, so here it is,  Please put this in the first post so everyone has it. Neeno's pdf has the original schemo which has mistakes. It might actually be good to download this file and attach it to your post so that is stays there and doesn't disappear if this guy's comcast account disappears. Or someone with PDF editiing capabilities could replace the schemo in Neeno's PDF with this.

http://home.comcast.net/~tamron1958/9K_Schematic_Corrections.pdf
Click to expand...

There is at least one error in that schematic. C63 is drawn between output of IC24 and ground, while on the PCB it's between pin 4 (VCC-, -18V) and pin 7 (VCC+, +18V). No 5534 (and few other op-amps) will be happy driving a 100n cap directly to ground.

Who originally published these corrections, BTW?

JDB.
 
JDB, I have no idea who wrote these up. I found it somewhere here. I'm assuming the first was Keith's, which Neeno put in the PDF in the first post. But that also has at least one error.. the compensation caps on the second pair of 5534 are in the feedback loop. They should be going between pin 5 and 8 of the 5534. It would be good to have one good schemo for as long as this project is still living.  Any other errors you see?

btw, here is a revised copy... I removed that cap and placed it at the bottom with the Cx,Cx and C85.
 

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Just wondering if this project would benefit from an output attenuator to drive the pre at all.

Also i could substitute MAT-02s with LM394's can't i.

Also just wondering what you guys are using gain pot wise, i can't seem to find any dual deck 2.5k pots?

Also while i'm at it, could i use a THAT1646 as the output driver for the balancing board?

http://au.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=1646S08-Uvirtualkey61220000virtualkey887-1646S08-U
this one

data sheet here

They seem to have all the same specs, i just have one spare :p means i can just add to it.

http://www.thatcorp.com/datashts/1600data.pdf
 
Morning chaps,

There is some discussion on Gearslutz in a thread titled "Cheaper alternative to AD MAT02 Transistor?". Jim Williams, who seems to be a respected name in the community, chimes in with the following:

"The LM394 is also discontinued, thankfully. I've never found a worse sounding transistor pair, very dark and nasal sounding."

Which took me by surprise, as I just bought 6 LM394s to build some SSL9ks...  I will have to seek out a ssm2210 or MAT02 now to try out and put my mind at ease!
 
mitsos said:
Any other errors you see?
Click to expand...

Nothing obvious at first glance, but I haven't done an in-depth review comparing the schematics to the parts datasheets and the PCB layout.

TheGuitarist said:
Also i could substitute MAT-02s with LM394's can't i.
Click to expand...

If you can still find those, yes. (And if you can, several folks here would love to know your source).

MikeClev said:
Jim Williams, who seems to be a respected name in the community, chimes in with the following:

"The LM394 is also discontinued, thankfully. I've never found a worse sounding transistor pair, very dark and nasal sounding."

Which took me by surprise, as I just bought 6 LM394s to build some SSL9ks...  I will have to seek out a ssm2210 or MAT02 now to try out and put my mind at ease!
Click to expand...

There is some evidence that at least for the last decade or so the LM394 and the MAT02 have had the same die, from the same factory. It is entirely possible that this wasn't yet the case when these parts were introduced some thirty years ago, and Jim's experience may be based on older stock. It is also likely that the SSM2210 (now also discontinued) has the same silicon, possibly after sorting (ie: the better-matched dies are reserved for the more expensive transistors).

JD 'Cold War kids were hard to kill, but this seems to be the end of these siblings' B.
 
TheGuitarist said:
Do the different revisions of lm394s or ssm2210's matter? for the ssms i see p and pz and for lm394 i see H and CH.
Click to expand...

When in doubt, check the datasheets.

JDB.
[DC offset does not matter much, nor does Pb-freeness for a DIYer. For the package you'd want a TO-78, although you can probably fudge a DIP in place as well if you're handy]
 
phishman13 said:
Ok, So I just received the MAT02s that stereokillah directed me to.  I'm attaching a picture for you to look at them and make a judgment yourself.  I know of course, that as rochey said, they could have just printed the markings on there to look like the real thing, but, you decide!  I haven't plugged them in or tested them in any way.  If someone knows of a good and relatively easy way to test these to determine whether they are acceptable or not from a more analytical standpoint (as opposed to just popping them in and listening) I'd be glad to do it.  I have a 2MHz function generator and a Oscope and a DMM, so I'd have to be able to do it with those tools.

Now don't go trying to steel my identity with those fingerprints!   :p :p

As for the contact that stereokillah gave and the company they came from, very clear and open communication.  very nice and accessible person that I dealt with.  She was there until the end.  They ship UPS and I wasn't in town to sign for it, so it was being held at the UPS hub.  she contacted me and said that her ups rep told her about it being held and wanted to alert me of that, and to make sure that I was going to be able to pick them up.  Very considerate.  Shipping was less that 2 weeks from 1st contact.

As long as they are genuine, good quality MAT02's, I highly recommend purchasing from them.  The only complaint I have so far is that they smell like moth balls!  I guess that's the price you pay.
Click to expand...

I bought a bunch of MAT02s form a Chinese source for use in some SSL 9k preamps.  I did a spot check with my cheap DVM, and the hfe reading on them was anywhere from 640 to 730 (Ib=10uA Vce=3V), but the 2 “sides” were usually matched well, within less that 10 units.  Is there a better way to “select” these transistors for use in the 9k?
Thanks!
Bruno2000
 

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