Vinyl records in year 2024

[Brian Roth]

I decided to continue/branch this discussion:

https://groupdiy.com/threads/sources-of-new-vinyl.87207/

...to this forum section. Reason? More than a few folks don't read the Brewery posts due to the amount of LOUD political arguments. I only personally only skim the topics listed each day there and choose to read very few threads.

I am part of a team here in little ol' Salina Kansas involved with vinyl record production. My cog in the machine is on the lacquer cutting/mastering side of the process. As far as plating and pressing I just watch the "magic" lol.

For decades the "death of vinyl" has been predicted....yet in the past few years more pressing plants have come online. Many are small "boutique" and "vanity" operations catering to low volume production.

Yet, some very large plants still are cranking out large quantities on vinyl here in the USA...and worldwide. Even rock stars have bought/built pressing companies.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/metallica-bought-its-own-vinyl-pressing-plant-180981855/

https://www.stereogum.com/2179538/jack-white-record-pressing-plant-major-labels/news/

Yeah, compared to streaming, vinyl is a niche...but alive and kicking.

No particular reason for this thread besides to widen the discussion from the Brewery. I know more than a few folks here "work with vinyl".

I recall meeting the 20-something year old son of a friend a few years ago who had never seen a turntable or a 12" LP! He was amazed since all he knew about music sourcing was streaming on his IPhone.

NOT wanting to begin an argument about how antique and "sucky" vinyl is...or how "awful" streaming sounds.
Just a reasonable discussion with pros in this business and their current work with this "obsolete" format.

Bri

 

[Brian Roth]

In the original thread, @cyrano mentioned the Czech company "GZ". That rang a bell for me here in the USA.

https://www.nashvillepressing.com/

According to the website:

Production will ramp up, hitting a maximum capacity exceeding 20 million records per year by the Fall of 2023. At full capacity, we plan to employ over 250 people.

Looks like they never got off the ground....

Bri

 

[Gold]

Nashville Pressing went to plan B I think. Brooklyn Phono closed up shop and the presses went there. I think they are ramping up production. GZ presses records for North America at Precision in Ontario and Memphis Record Pressing. Sometimes they ship from Czech.

 

[totoxraymond]

My band's first EP is currently in production in Prague, Very small quantity: 300ex.

My only concern so far is not being able to talk to the cutting engineer directly (i'm dealing with a small spanish company who does the interface with the different plants for CDs and vinyls). They actually screwed up the first samples, we asked for 45 rpm and received 33 rpm...

 

[Brian Roth]

It seems that more than a few "vinyl" vendors have appeared recently. Some/many own maybe a single pressing machine and are otherwise clueless.

Bri

 

[zamproject]

They actually screwed up the first samples, we asked for 45 rpm and received 33 rpm...

Is the mistake from the plant or intermediate company ?

I had client that deal direct with the GZ company.
IIRC before that I had a talk around the forum and Paul suggested a 45rpm cut.
I talked about it to my client but he forget to forward the info, the plant come back before the cut telling us they can do this record at 45 ! So I suppose they know what they do ?!?
The sound is gorgeous !

My advice for everyone, if possible, cut at 45RPM.
To me the payback is so great that reviewing the tracklist or even sacrifice a track to fit max 45 timing can be questioned.

Cheers
Zam

 

[Gold]

It seems that more than a few "vinyl" vendors have appeared recently. Some/many own maybe a single pressing machine and are otherwise clueless.

Bri

There have always been brokers for records, CD's and cassettes. A broker will take care of the whole production. If you are inexperienced with record production it can be a good move to find someone who deals with it everyday. Most plants only press records. They don't do printing or lacquer cutting or drop shipping. Even some labels use brokers so they don't have to deal with it. There are good and bad brokers just like anything else.

 

[totoxraymond]

Is the mistake from the plant or intermediate company ?

The mistake is clearly from the plant, tje intermediate company has shown me the purchase order specifying a 45 rpm.

There are other poblems also, it sounds distorted with a lot less dynamic than the master (which doesn't have much left, it's a punk rock band).
And the overall volume is pretty low compared to my other discs.

I'll keep you posted when i hear back from the factory.

Thomas

 

[zamproject]

it sounds distorted with a lot less dynamic than the master (which doesn't have much left, it's a punk rock band).

Did you send a limiter-less premaster for the cuter ? vinyl don't like square wave

And the overall volume is pretty low compared to my other discs.

This is directly linked to the overall length IIRC (@Gold know better)

What is your album length ? maybe it's also the reason they don't cut at 45RPM ?!?

 

[MidnightArrakis]

My band's first EP is currently in production in Prague, Very small quantity: 300ex.

My only concern so far is not being able to talk to the cutting engineer directly (i'm dealing with a small spanish company who does the interface with the different plants for CDs and vinyls). They actually screwed up the first samples, we asked for 45 rpm and received 33 rpm...

[we asked for 45 rpm and received 33 rpm] -- So.....your band's music was played-back "slower"???.....

/

 

[Gold]

[we asked for 45 rpm and received 33 rpm] -- So.....your band's music was played-back "slower"???.....

/

Hopefully not. That would be two mistakes. A 7” record at 33 1/3 RPM usually sounds bad, for lack of a better word.

The high end is usually distorted. This is due to the smaller inner diameter of a 7” compared to a 12” record and the resulting tracing distortion.

Tracing distortion is due to the shrinking wavelength for any given frequency at the inner diameter. This is exacerbated by the corresponding reduction in linear velocity at the inner diameter.

 

[Brian Roth]

12" 45 RPM records seem to be a "thing" recently. I know Matt often cuts lacquers in that format here at The Mastering Lab. I don't think 7" lacquers are ever cut; I've never seen the smaller lacquer blanks in stock.

Bri

 

[Gold]

12” 45 started being a thing in the late 1970’s -early 1980’s. It started as 12” singles where there would be a single track, really freakin loud, per side. Sometimes one side at 45 and the otjer at 33 if it was too long to fit at 45. These are DJ records.

EP’s of four to six songs were and are issued as 12” 45.

The newish thing is reissuing two sided records at 33 as four sided records at 45. Chad seems to be all in on that.

 

[Brian Roth]

12” 45 started being a thing in the late 1970’s -early 1980’s. It started as 12” singles where there would be a single track, really freakin loud, per side. Sometimes one side at 45 and the otjer at 33 if it was too long to fit at 45. These are DJ records.

EP’s of four to six songs were and are issued as 12” 45.

The newish thing is reissuing two sided records at 33 as four sided records at 45. Chad seems to be all in on that.

I remember 12" 45 records as "extended versions" used at discos.

Yep, today the audiophiles seem to "swoon" over the 45 RPM releases. I've heard some test pressings of those and they DO seem to have a great sound. Among other things, I could swear the noise floor is more akin to a quality digital recording.

Bri

 

[Brian Roth]

I knew that Chad was "all in" to 45 RPM, but I was totally surprised after I looked:

https://store.acousticsounds.com/c/21/45_RPM_Vinyl_Record

Website says 504 titles.....

Bri

 

[Gold]

I remember 12" 45 records as "extended versions" used at discos.

Yep, today the audiophiles seem to "swoon" over the 45 RPM releases. I've heard some test pressings of those and they DO seem to have a great sound. Among other things, I could swear the noise floor is more akin to a quality digital recording.

Bri

The noise floor should basically be the same on a 12” 45 as a 12” 33. The only thing the speed of the record would affect is the frequency of any noise. The faster the record the higher the frequency. So actually for a given amount of noise it should be more noticeable at 45 than 33.

What is probably going on is that you can cut louder cleaner sides at 45. So the signal to noise ratio is better but the noise floor is probably similar to cutting at 33 on the same lacquer.

 

[Brian Roth]

I am not an expert on the whole 2024 "state of the art" with vinyl. While I regularly am involved with the cutting system....the guy who comes in and tracks down electronics issues...the nuances of cutting and pressing are not my forte <g>.

Paul, when you cut a 12" 45 do you cut it hotter? Next time when I chat with Matt I'll ask him the same question.

Bri

 

[Gold]

Paul, when you cut a 12" 45 do you cut it hotter? Next time when I chat with Matt I'll ask him the same question.

Bri

Everything gets cut “as loud as possible”. That’s a big part of the gig. What’s prudent to do is also a big part of the gig.

 

[Brian Roth]

Everything gets cut “as loud as possible”. That’s a big part of the gig. What’s prudent to do is also a big part of the gig.

OK...I'm not the cutting guy....I just keep the electronics working! lol

Bri

 

[Brian Roth]

Semi related....how do you decide what is "too hot" for reliable playback on mainstream pickups/arms?

I kinda recall a story about very early Led Zep II albums being recalled because they were "unplayable".

Bri